• Some users have recently had their accounts hijacked. It seems that the now defunct EVGA forums might have compromised your password there and seems many are using the same PW here. We would suggest you UPDATE YOUR PASSWORD and TURN ON 2FA for your account here to further secure it. None of the compromised accounts had 2FA turned on.
    Once you have enabled 2FA, your account will be updated soon to show a badge, letting other members know that you use 2FA to protect your account. This should be beneficial for everyone that uses FSFT.

Any thoughts about this system...

M

Michael Younger

Weaksauce
Joined
Oct 17, 2004
Messages
77
Of course I'll be configuring the system around the video card.

My options are:

128MB PCI Express™ x16 (DVI/VGA/TV-out) ATI Radeon™ X300 SE
256MB Nvidia® GeForce 6800 GTO Graphics Card [add $400 or $10/month1]
256MB PCI Express™ x16 (DVI/VGA/TV-out) nVidia GeForce 6800 [add $200 or $5/month1]
256MB PCI Express™ x16 (DVI/VGA/TV-out) ATI Radeon™ X850 XT PE [add $500 or $13/month1]!

Seems pretty obvious that my choice should by the ATI Radeon X850 - right?

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

My options for sound card are as follows...

Integrated Audio with Dolby Digital 5.1 capability
Sound Blaster® Live! 24-bit ADVANCED HD™ Audio [add $50 or $1/month1]
Sound Blaster Audigy™2 ZS (D) Card w/Dolby 5.1, and IEEE 1394 capability [add $100 or $2/month1]!

Does anybody see anything wrong with the Sound Blaster Live option - I'll be using a pair of headphones with this.

If I recall correctly, somebody said that a certain card from Creative Labs causes a lot of problems - I can't remember which card it was?

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Then there's the question of RAM.

512MB Dual Channel DDR2 SDRAM at 400MHz (2x256M)
1GB Dual Channel DDR2 SDRAM at 400MHz (2x512M) [add $200 or $5/month1]
2GB Dual Channel DDR2 SDRAM at 400MHz (2x1GB) [add $850 or $21/month1]
4GB Dual Channel DDR2 SDRAM at 400MHz (4x1GB) [add $1,650 or $42/month1]
512MB Dual Channel DDR2 SDRAM at 533MHz (2x256M) [add $50 or $1/month1]
1GB Dual Channel DDR2 SDRAM at 533MHz (2x512M) [add $250 or $6/month1]!
2GB Dual Channel DDR2 SDRAM at 533MHz (2x1GB) [add $900 or $23/month1]
4GB Dual Channel DDR2 SDRAM at 533MHz (4x1GB) [add $1,750 or $44/month1]

Should I buy 1GB at 400MHz or 1GB at 533MHz? Seriously, will I notice much of a difference, or any at all, if I pay 50 bucks more and opt for the speedier RAM?

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Processor speed.

Pentium® 4 Processor 660 with HT Technology (3.60GHz, 800 FSB) [add $750 or $19/month1]!Advanced Performance
Pentium® 4 Processor 650 with HT Technology (3.40GHz, 800 FSB) [add $400 or $10/month1]
Pentium® 4 Processor 640 with HT Technology (3.20GHz, 800 FSB) [add $150 or $4/month1]
Pentium® 4 Processor 630 with HT Technology (3GHz, 800 FSB)

Not much I can do about this. Anything above 3GHz pretty much breaks my budget.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Am I correct in buying the fast video card in conjunction with the slower CPU, rather than buying a fast CPU in conjunction with a slower video card? The primary purpose here is to play the latest computer games... Half-life 2, Vampire: Bloodlines, The Sims 2, Thief 3, Far Cry, etc. etc.

Ideally, in a perfect world, I could afford a cutting edge video card AND a super fast processor - I can't. I have to compromise on either the one or the other.

Also, I'm living in Canada, and these prices are in Canadian dollars. I'm not going to buy a PC from across the border, so this is my only option. Nor am I going to build my own PC. Nor am I going to commission some kid to assemble one for me.

Any thoughts?
 
I would say to take the X850, the gig of ddr533 RAM and the 3ghz processor (unless you can gather the money for the 3.2, which, personally, I would suggest). The Intel system will be moderately good for gaming, although nothing like an AMD. The faster RAM will help with improving framerates a smidgeon, although there is really no difference between DDR and DDR2 (DDR2 being what is offered with that system).

Also, can i take a guess that you're building a Dell 8400 or XPS computer (my dad recently purchased an XPS Gen.4)?

EDIT: Oh, and he got his with a 3.4ghz processor but the 6800nu. Personally, i would have taken the slightly slower processor and the much faster card, but he did get the gig of ddr2 533 RAM, and scores around 100 fps on the Counter-Strike:Source Stress Test at Max Detail, Reflect world (water settings), 4x AA and 8x AF @ 1280x1024 on the Dell 19" (non ultrashap monitor) LCD and there's absolutely no ghosting.
 
If you're going to build a gaming rig you should really start with an Athlon 64 Winchester (90nm). Note the preponderance of green at the top of these benchmarks. Plus if you buy a machine with an NForce 4 Ultra motherboard, you can get a very fast but reasonably priced CPU now and then (probably) add a dual core CPU later. Current Intel motherboards will not accept dual core CPUs. Of course, this makes it more difficult if you want to buy an off-the-rack machine, but it's probably a better choice in the long run.

Am I correct in buying the fast video card in conjunction with the slower CPU, rather than buying a fast CPU in conjunction with a slower video card?
Click to expand...
Any time you go to the top-of-the-line hardware, you're paying through the nose for a small increase in performance. It's best to avoid the most expensive hardware because they are rarely good deals. Just drop back a notch or two from the top and you get the best deals. You can save a lot of money that way and then use the difference to get an upgrade a year from now and keep your machine close to the leading edge.
 
Now, now guys. He's asking for what he can get from those options (with what I presume is a Dell from the '6800 GTO')
 
with your choices:

ATI Radeon™ X850 XT PE
Sound card (whatever one)
1GB Dual Channel DDR2 SDRAM at 533MHz
Pentium® 4 Processor 650 with HT Technology (3.40GHz, 800 FSB)($350 for 20 more mhz? No way, You could OC to that)

A better system for gaming;:

Radeon X850XT
1 GB Corsair ultra low latency (2-2-2-5) DDR Ram
AMD Athlon 64 3500+/3800+
 
I was looking at that Dell too (XPS). I was also looking at the Alienware and I am surprised alienware does not offer an AMD-based computer for gaming except the SLi version, which is too expensive for me.

EDIT: With PCI-E
 
Alright be sure to get the Audigy 2 ZS though, there's problems with the origional Audigys, although i'm not sure as to what models.
 
solideliquid said:
I was looking at that Dell too (XPS). I was also looking at the Alienware and I am surprised alienware does not offer an AMD-based computer for gaming except the SLi version, which is too expensive for me.

EDIT: With PCI-E
Click to expand...


Then, choose the SLi-based system, knock off a videocard, and there you go, and you can buy a 2nd card direct from them later on. If this isn't what you were thinking, nevermind.
 
hmm... dell doesnt seem to offer an AMD based system...

Hmm... looking at both HP and Dell, neither seems to offer a good gaming system. I would just make it yourself. Cheaper, with better performance...
 
What is a good company that will build me an AMD based computer? (the way you can get a computer from Dell or Alienware)
 
He stated he doesn't want to build it, so I'm assuming that he either A. doesn't have the skills; B. doesn't have the time; or C. is lazy.

Not to be insulting in any manner, but I can apply to the last one :) but I have a lot of fun building PCs, and I plan to do so for my next one.
 
Since you mention option C I will tell you why I am not building my own. (no offense taken)

1. Lack expertise

2. Lack time

3. Graduating medical school this year, refer to 2.
 
Okay, no problem at all. My dad didn't have the time so he got his XPS. That's how it goes around here. He buys a built system that is faster than my current one, then I build one that completely destroys his. Works for me :D
 
I wish I had both the time and skills to build my own, but what I think will happen is I will fry the moherboard and make like miserable for my wife when I freak out. She will then freak out and our life will suck. Plus I will waste money so....hello Dell. :D
 
You wouldn't fry it, the only way I've ever killed a motherboard is a bad BIOS flash (which I really, really want to correct). I've pulled the motherboard multiple times, and have tried 3 different ones (Leadtek K-something-or-another Pro, Gigabyte something, and an Abit NF7(the fried one)).
 
http://www.newegg.com/app/viewproductdesc.asp?description=83-102-611&DEPA=0

I think this computer is SERIOUSLY overlooked. It's got an amazing price tag for what's packing. Give it some serious thought... What's scary is that, I built practically the same computer a few weeks before this showed up on the egg... same case.. same gpu / cpu... I built mine for a little under 2000... but this is still an insane deal as far as retail computers go. Personally, I think dell is a nice company... but the intels don't cut it for gaming (and the XPS is overpriced... just upgrade an 8600 to the XPS specs). Alienware is way overpriced.
 
Huh, that's odd, I've seen that. But, that's out of my price range as a one-shot deal. I can spend that over a period of time, but not up front.
 
It's definitely A) Do not have the skills!

Trust me. I attempted to install a CD ROM drive once - not pretty.

It's a shame that I can't afford a faster CPU - because I'm assuming that a 3 GHz Intel will bottleneck the ATI X 850. I should overclock, you say? Trust me. If I attempt to do this, something seriously bad will happen. I guarantee it.

As far as purchasing a system with an AMD processor is concerned, well I would like to do that, but Dell doesn't offer such an option. Remember, I'm in Canada, and I am not going to buy a computer from a company that's across the border.

The reason I didn't mention that I'll be buying from Dell should be obvious - a lot of people around here really hate Dell, and if you mention that you'll be buying from them then they just tell you that you're an idiot (and I already know that).

Actually, I don't mind buying a Dell at all. I'm sure that it'll run those abovementioned games just fine.

Just one last question. A lot of people have suggested I buy the faster RAM - at 533 MHZ. Is this really, really going to be an improvement.

This option costs another 50 bucks. My friend told me to spend an extra 30 bucks on the Logitech mouse option as well. While somebody else told me to spend a bit of extra money for more hard-drive space. 50 bucks here, 30 bucks there - it all mounts up, n'est ce pas?
 
Oui, c'est vrai!.

But, the DDR2 @ 533 will net you a few more FPS in HL2 and Doom3 (more taxing games). But, are you sure that you can't get the 3.2? I mean, it would help a lot. Also, every top-of-the-line is currently bottlenecked by the CPUs. I mean, UT2k4 is CPU bound (even by an FX-55!)
 
Intel_Hydralisk said:
Forget overclocking anyway... Dells can't be overclocked.
Click to expand...

Yeah, that's very true. If you could overclock, Dells wouldn't be a clutch stability computer. And, beware of the videocards, they can be cheaper OEM versions (my dad's 6800 didn't have RAM-sinks and only ran at 600 mhz on the memory, mine runs at 700 stock)
 
Okay, I'll consider going for the 3.2 GHz CPU rather than the 3.0 GHz option. I wouldn't have thought it would make much difference, but that's why I created this thread.
 
Well you could buy that system but why pay more for less?? The 3000+ will absolutely kill a 3.0 p4 for gaming about 10-15 fps on average. Also you can overclock the 3000+ from 1.8Ghz to 2.5Ghz on stock cooling!!! You have to get a P4 up to 5.0Ghz to compare to that!!

Now I know this Is not a cheep system that I’m showing you here but nor is it anywhere close to as slow as the one you are looking at… I have seen the difference in speed from the Intel to the AMD first hand. The MSI board should pull over 4Ghz of mem bandwith the OCZ 4800 ram in it, compared to the 2Ghz that you would get from dell L I have tested it and that’s not a advertised speed witch is way off I might add. This mem will run bad ass timings and still run 600Mhz +

Not to mention the bad ass Nvidia Raid chip on board the MSI. It will pull 100-115MB/s
In raid0 that’s the fastest of the fastest out there with out going to a server or workstaion mother board. Witch would be ok to do except then you cant overclock, and your stuck paying out more for the fast cpu’s just to get some decent performance out of your hard disks. Witch I think is very important now with them being the slowest part of the system!! Sigh oh man do I hate using my old system with out raided drives :D


If you need someone to build a tower for ya I would be more than happy to setup and tweek your tower for a $100.00 as I have done for about 18 others in the last year (I run my own small town retail store mainly in car audio but I also enjoy professinal gaming at its best :D)

Thermaltake Black Xaser V Damier Full-Tower Case Model "V5000+" -RETAIL $102.00

Spring Break Sale, Ends 3/28/2005 6:00 AM PST
NEC 16X Double Layer DVD±RW Drive, Black, Model ND-3520A BK, OEM $53.99

Seagate 7200.8 300GB 7200RPM SATA NCQ Hard Drive, Model ST3300831AS, OEM $195.00 each

OCZ Enhanced Latency Platinum Series, 184-Pin 512MB DDR PC-4800 -Retail
$159.00 each

Spring Break Sale, Ends 3/28/2005 6:00 AM PST
SAMSUNG 910T-Black 19" LCD Monitor -RETAIL $409.99

MSI "K8N Neo2 Platinum" NVIDIA nForce3 ULTRA Chipset Motherboard For AMD Socket 939 CPU -RETAIL $142.50

Spring Break Sale, Ends 3/28/2005 6:00 AM PST
Thermaltake Silent PurePower, 420W ATX power supply.UL, CSA, TUV, CE Approved. Intel Pentium 4 Compliant $36.99

AMD Athlon 64 3000+, 512KB L2 Cache, Socket 939 64-bit Processor - Retail
$146.00

Spring Break Sale, Ends 3/28/2005 6:00 AM PST
Leadtek nVIDIA GeForce 6800 GT Video Card, 256MB GDDR3, 256-Bit, TV-Out/DVI, 8X AGP, Model "A400 GT TDH" -RETAIL $365.00


I would say I could save ya about $500.00 or more if you don’t want the best of the best for a gaming system that would still be a lot better for gaming than that 3.0 Intel.

Now if you were big into video editing I might sway toward the Intel if you do lots of riping and compressing.

All tho the AMD FX chip is still the best of the best (in my opinion) as of right now even for riping and encoding due to the fact that it has the 1024cache and can be O/C’ed to 3.0Ghz stock.
 
Michael Younger said:
Okay, I'll consider going for the 3.2 GHz CPU rather than the 3.0 GHz option. I wouldn't have thought it would make much difference, but that's why I created this thread.
Click to expand...

It will make a big difference, maybe 5 (or more) fps in most games.

Hey, guess what Formula, he wants a Dell, give him helpful information on the Dell. Don't side track him with a system that he must build himself. If he couldn't get a CD drive in (I could do that a few years back, I was 10 i guess ;)) then don't task him with building a whole computer.
 
Proprietary parts. And, Dell is known for stability, the BIOS are locked and so are the chips, although, you could TRY a windows based OC'ing utility, but results may vary. Oh, and the videocards do OC.
 
Project_2501 Hey, guess what Formula, he wants a Dell, give him helpful information on the Dell. Don't side track him with a system that he must build himself. If he couldn't get a CD drive in (I could do that a few years back, I was 10 i guess ) then don't task him with building a whole computer.
Click to expand...

Ok, i agree just thought i would try to get him some more performance for the dollar ;)

As far as the memory dont wast your money on faster memory more is way better than faster.(as the mem now days is already fast!)

Save up for the best damn cpu you can afford. I currently am runing a 3.0e @ 3.9 and its still is the bottle neck not that its a bad system.

As far as the video card go's the faster the video card the higher the resolution the game can be played at. so the more pixels on the screen, the smother the game images look (eye candy)
so not needed just looks nice
me personly would get a 6800gt to suit my needs :D
 
Formula383 said:
Ok, i agree just thought i would try to get him some more performance for the dollar ;)

As far as the memory dont wast your money on faster memory more is way better than faster.(as the mem now days is already fast!)

Save up for the best damn cpu you can afford. I currently am runing a 3.0e @ 3.9 and its still is the bottle neck not that its a bad system.

As far as the video card go's the faster the video card the higher the resolution the game can be played at. so the more pixels on the screen, the smother the game images look (eye candy)
so not needed just looks nice
me personly would get a 6800gt to suit my needs :D
Click to expand...

He's already getting the gig, any the new P4's run at DDR2 533 stock, and the faster speeds do help. Compare DDR 200 to 266, 266 to 333, 333 to 400, 400 to whatever OC is possible. Each increace yields a boost in performance.

He already said that much more than a 3ghz will "break the bank" but I still suggest the 3.2. Also, I reccomend the X850XT PE, because if you can spend the money for it, it's the fastest single card made.
 
He's already getting the gig, any the new P4's run at DDR2 533 stock, and the faster speeds do help. Compare DDR 200 to 266, 266 to 333, 333 to 400, 400 to whatever OC is possible. Each increace yields a boost in performance.
Click to expand...

OK so lets take a look at actual performance increase from 400 to 533, yes faster mhz
But what about latency’s oh let me see gee look at that the DDR2 has CRAP did I mention CRAP. Timings so ok yea its faster mhz and might possible be able to tell that its faster with a bench marking score maybe why waste the money when he could save the money and put it toward a faster cpu that would give him overall a notice able system improvement and I don’t see the need for the $500.00 video card when its just for the eye candy and I would much rather play on a smother system than have all the eye candy turned on.

http://www.overclockercafe.com/Articles/DDR_vs_DDR2/pg_5.htm
 
I realize that DDR2 has awful timings, but the 400 and 533 timings aren't far apart, if not the same for the modules Dell uses. And, what's the point of spending a lot of money for a card if you can't make it look nice?
 
An AMD based system will offer better performance in games. Plus, some of Dell's upgrades are really expensive once you get past their base models, for example their memory and cpu upgrades.

Anyways, I own a small computer business and could build a system for you. I have a few distributors, so I can get products for about 5% cheaper than what you typically find on newegg. I just put this system together for you to demonstrate what I can build and how cheaply I can do it.

CPU: AMD Athlon 64 3200+ 512K 90nm Socket 939
Mobo: Asus A8N-SLI NForce4
Video: eVGA 6800 GT 256MB PCI-E
Memory: Corsair ValueSelect 1GB (2 x 512MB) DDR400(PC3200) #VS1GBKIT400
Hard Drive: Seagate 160GB Serial ATA 7200RPM 8MB with NCQ #ST3160827AS
DVD-Burner: NEC 16X Double Layer DVD±RW Drive #ND-3520A BK
Case: Antec P160 Anodized Aluminum Super Mid Tower Case
Power Supply: 480W Antec NeoPower 480 ATX12V v2.0

I can build that exact system for you for only $1250 shipped. If you, or anyone else I guess for that matter, is interested, let me know. I can always add in a sound card like you had mentioned, upgrade a part, put two hard drives in a raid configuration, or change the case. My prices will be much cheaper than those of Dell and will offer you much better gaming performance.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top