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hopefully these wont be fake prices or get scalped to the moon...
View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UknscCm4Y6Y
View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UknscCm4Y6Y
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9060xt
- Thread starter pendragon1
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cool, this isnt about the 5060....
It'll be interesting to see how these perform. They have a slightly larger die and more claimed transistors than a 5060Ti, OTOH they have less memory bandwidth. I'm guessing they'll end up between a 4060Ti and a 5060Ti and beat up on the 5060 pretty hard when equipped with 16GB, but that's just a guess. Kinda eyeballing some numbers for the 9070XT, figuring this thing is half of that except for the ram on the 16GB version, fudging the numbers up a bit since we always seem to get diminishing returns out of bigger, more powerful cards and the 9060XT is clocked slightly higher than the 9070XT. I'm also expecting that the NV 60 cards will have a relative advantage at higher resolution due to having more memory bandwidth.
I'm also wondering what AMD is going to do with the cut-down version of this chip. They'll make one eventually -- gotta do something with the imperfect chips, right? If they really want to stick it in and twist they'll make 8GB and 16GB versions of a 9050 or 9060. Maybe both if they want to stick it to Intel too. The point here is that I'd love to see AMD make a 16GB card for less than $350.
I'm also wondering what AMD is going to do with the cut-down version of this chip. They'll make one eventually -- gotta do something with the imperfect chips, right? If they really want to stick it in and twist they'll make 8GB and 16GB versions of a 9050 or 9060. Maybe both if they want to stick it to Intel too. The point here is that I'd love to see AMD make a 16GB card for less than $350.
It should be at least a bit faster than the 7700xt as a minimum as a maximum a bit lower than the 7800xt, with the clock announced and the benchmark AMD did show:
33-40% faster than a 3060ti for when if fit in the vram maybe ? for things (if you go for 16gb) for things that overflow the 8GB it can get massive.
Newegg and MicroCenter both had lots of 9070XTs at launch, so I'm guessing those two are probably your best bets. MSRP 9070XT and 9070 cards sold out right away at Newegg, but above MSRP cards were available for a while, maybe 20-30 minutes. MicroCenter stores typically took a few hours to get everyone through the line.
crazycrave
2[H]4U
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I may pick one up if I can find one, Micro Center is about an hour away if needed.
9060XT 16GB is the one I would go for. The extra memory makes it way better than any 8GB version of the 5060, Especially if you run 1440p.
Microcenter is the best source if there is one near you. Otherwise you'll have to look on sites like Best Buy, Amazon, Newegg, etc.
TechPowerUp Review on Asus Prime 16gb
https://www.techpowerup.com/review/asus-radeon-rx-9060-xt-prime-oc-16-gb/
https://www.techpowerup.com/review/asus-radeon-rx-9060-xt-prime-oc-16-gb/
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Still not something worth buying, IMO. "AMD never missing an opportunity to miss an opportunity". The prices are the main factor. If AMD priced everything one tier lower, they for sure would have won even me over. Imagine the 9070 XT priced at $350, 9070 at $295, and 9060 XT priced at $240, no one would be buying NVIDIA's 5000 series, and AMD would be the go-to choice. If they also stopped making 8GB cards and made 12GB the minimum, they'd probably even be more popular. Instead, AMD continues to be NVIDIA-lite.
Sure, sell cards at a massive loss... what a strategy. I am sure the board partners would be overjoyed.
Geforcepat
[H]ard|Gawd
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Yeah, I'm Not sure what he's on about. That doesn't even make sense 8-10 years ago. Much less now.
And imagine if they made 20 millions 9070xt and sold them $250 instead, they would have filled the world with people upgrading their pascal/turing/3060... and took a 50%+ market share among new GPU right away...
It is easy to say: imagine if AMD products were less than half their current price and their production were 25x+ time more to be able to fill that demand at that price point they would sales well, yes of course.
Nvidia 5060ti is around the same /a tiny bit faster with "21,900 millions" transistor (181mm die) than the 9060xt with 29.7 millions transistor (199mm die), having to bet I would put it that those numbers are inflated/wrong, but still, chance are with the 8.0x pci, lower power, even with GDDR7 that the price difference is either thin or in Nvidia favor once the memory yield get good, by marginal unit without even counting amortizing-volume rebate, much greater binning (GB206 become 5060, laptops, RTX pro 2000....).
People talk of AMD being Nvidia minus $50, but that in part because Nvidia play the AMD+50 buck game has well, if AMD launch something were they loose money aggressively, Nvidia super line up pricing will match that, keeping the market share were they are, just less margin-eating their other product line more and Nvidia with the cheaper card/volume/binning sku stacks/higher price would do better.
If we look at newegg best sellings gpu here:
https://www.newegg.com/d/Best-Selle...jbXuJLQia6ACh2y9b506_N0y4uFu84nnKYxxAuiU9D_VJ
How a $300-$350 offering (would it exist) of 9060xt-9060xt16 not by far the best offer in that price range, people are paying over $400 for 4060..., $360 for a 7600xt. If they made a lot of them and put them near MSRP in store in the current market, that would be jumping on the current opportunity, much better than Intel is doing. It is so good in some market like the US online available market that it is hard to believe they will exist, I think everyone assume it will be hard to press add to card without some tricks/luck for a $350 9060xt16GB for a long time.
In a way a $350 gpu launching mid 2025 not cleaning beating 6800 of 2020 is a deception when you were used to previous pace (say a 1060 vs a $650 GTX 780 that was just 3 years old), but we got used to that change of pace for CPU, for harddrive, for ram, GPU started later, gpu had the easy parallelism baked in, went from niche to mainstream that was not mature and had still a lot of optimization possibles (they were often really quickly coded chips with a yearly rotation versus drawn and super optimized a lot by hands CPU that had this will be a base used for a decade effort going in them) and much bigger/watts/price over time pushing back the decline in time later than those,
But they face this:
Since covid rdna 2 early days(TSMC 7), they cannot buy more transistors per dollars, the 9060xt does not have more transistor than the 6800 had really and they had to cut memory bus in half and other things around to reduce the price ....
It is easy to say: imagine if AMD products were less than half their current price and their production were 25x+ time more to be able to fill that demand at that price point they would sales well, yes of course.
Nvidia 5060ti is around the same /a tiny bit faster with "21,900 millions" transistor (181mm die) than the 9060xt with 29.7 millions transistor (199mm die), having to bet I would put it that those numbers are inflated/wrong, but still, chance are with the 8.0x pci, lower power, even with GDDR7 that the price difference is either thin or in Nvidia favor once the memory yield get good, by marginal unit without even counting amortizing-volume rebate, much greater binning (GB206 become 5060, laptops, RTX pro 2000....).
People talk of AMD being Nvidia minus $50, but that in part because Nvidia play the AMD+50 buck game has well, if AMD launch something were they loose money aggressively, Nvidia super line up pricing will match that, keeping the market share were they are, just less margin-eating their other product line more and Nvidia with the cheaper card/volume/binning sku stacks/higher price would do better.
If we look at newegg best sellings gpu here:
https://www.newegg.com/d/Best-Selle...jbXuJLQia6ACh2y9b506_N0y4uFu84nnKYxxAuiU9D_VJ
How a $300-$350 offering (would it exist) of 9060xt-9060xt16 not by far the best offer in that price range, people are paying over $400 for 4060..., $360 for a 7600xt. If they made a lot of them and put them near MSRP in store in the current market, that would be jumping on the current opportunity, much better than Intel is doing. It is so good in some market like the US online available market that it is hard to believe they will exist, I think everyone assume it will be hard to press add to card without some tricks/luck for a $350 9060xt16GB for a long time.
In a way a $350 gpu launching mid 2025 not cleaning beating 6800 of 2020 is a deception when you were used to previous pace (say a 1060 vs a $650 GTX 780 that was just 3 years old), but we got used to that change of pace for CPU, for harddrive, for ram, GPU started later, gpu had the easy parallelism baked in, went from niche to mainstream that was not mature and had still a lot of optimization possibles (they were often really quickly coded chips with a yearly rotation versus drawn and super optimized a lot by hands CPU that had this will be a base used for a decade effort going in them) and much bigger/watts/price over time pushing back the decline in time later than those,
But they face this:
Since covid rdna 2 early days(TSMC 7), they cannot buy more transistors per dollars, the 9060xt does not have more transistor than the 6800 had really and they had to cut memory bus in half and other things around to reduce the price ....
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Those days are loooong gone unfortunately...
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I don't care about either company, and they're making billions either way. The 5060 and 9060 XT are the lowest-end cards priced at $300 for 8GB. They priced the MSRP for the 5600 XT at $279, 6600 XT $379, and the 7600 XT at $329. Pricing the 9060 XT at $239 would have been gigantic. If they were looking to gain back market share from NVIDIA, $299 and $349 isn't going to do it, because no one's going to be tempted to buy it. No one with a 3070 or 6700 XT is going to downgrade to it, and they're only enticing 4060 and 7600 XT users, who are already doing fine playing at 1080P with those cards. The only ones probably considering a 5060 or 9060 XT are those with RTX 3060's or 6600 XT's, and they can find used 3070's at least for much lower (but not 6700 XT's, because AMD GPU's always resell much higher for some dumb reason).
Once again, what a terrible business strategy you have come up with. Nobody is going to sell a new product at a massive loss because you can get a used product for cheaper. How on God's green earth do you suggest that AMD tell their board partners that are already selling cards on razor thin margins to now take a couple hundred dollar haircut on their sales because some guy on a forum thinks it's a great idea.
Axman
VP of Extreme Liberty
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When they're the only option because Nvidia isn't making video cards I don't see how they won't sell them all.
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Because some other guy on a forum thinks they'll operate at a loss, even when the 5600 XT in 2020 sold for $279 in 2020, and they made $9.7 Billion that year, with a market share of 17% at the end of the year (and that's with AIB, mobile, and dGPU's). Some other guy on a forum thinks the only way to make revenue is to increase prices on a low amount of products that don't get purchased. While some other guy on a forum thinks lowering prices so said products get purchased, thus increasing demand and market share.
You do realize that you are comparing the economy from 5 years ago to today, correct? The price of everything has increased so the comparison is not going to line up at all.
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What? 2020 was 5 years ago? You don't say...
The RTX 3070 8GB that outperforms the 9060 XT was released in 2020... 5 years ago. Hilarious.
What is your point? That they should sell cards at a loss because a $499 MSRP card from 2020 has the same performance? Please tell me what multi-billion dollar company you are the CFO for so I can make sure I don't invest in it.
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These prices are the new normal.. Only way they will go down is if EVERYONE cold turkey stopped buying them...
But.. everyone lines up wee hours of the morning of new release.. (after a night of eating cheesy puffs in mommys basement) and forks over their $$ without a second thought.. (might even throw in a selfie also for those "thumbs up and likes".. if they have the time for it)
But.. everyone lines up wee hours of the morning of new release.. (after a night of eating cheesy puffs in mommys basement) and forks over their $$ without a second thought.. (might even throw in a selfie also for those "thumbs up and likes".. if they have the time for it)
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The point is a $299 and $349 low-end card won't sell well (indicated by how the 7600 XT didn't do so well at $329 in 2024, but neither did the RTX 4060 in 2023). Maybe re-read my above quoted posts and you'll understand why.
They would have to have access to the chips to make that many and even then those chips, the wafers just might make them more money by turning them into cpus instead.
ZeroBarrier
[H]ard|Gawd
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Let's at least be honest here. Nvidia hasn't given a rats ass what AMD does with Radeon since RTX has released. Not a single ounce of consideration as they have been fully aware that AMD can no longer compete.
Axman
VP of Extreme Liberty
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Lol.
Around 4.5% of steam hardware survey, even if we assume all card are in a steam machine right now that, if steam active accounts estimate are about right:
Thats about 8-8.5 millions 4060 sold, not sure how many in 2022/2024 versus 2023, but on what it is based on that the 4060 did not sold well ? What volume would go into well category, 10 millions units, 12 ?
Maybe it is not mostly in response to AMD, but there is a reason they cut down pricing to their super line up and a reason they used that new price for the blackwell launch announcement. They do tend to time announcement/review embargo/etc... with quite the suspicious timing with AMD one, too much to be random.
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They can compete, they just choose not to. There's a reason this saying about AMD is so popular: "AMD, never missing an opportunity to miss an opportunity". They'd rather follow NVIDIA's footsteps and are okay grabbing NVIDIA's leftovers. You are right though, NVIDIA doesn't care what AMD does, they don't lower their prices based on AMD's releases and prices, since they know AMD will price theirs according to NVIDIA's.
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Yet, the sale numbers of RTX 4060's weren't very high. My guess is that the low end cards are bundled with low-end CPU's in cheaper prebuilt gaming systems, and more people buy those.
Do we have those, the best-buy, newegg, amazon one, not the enthusiast boutique ? yes pre-built could be a big market for those, and I imagine China is by far the biggest gpu market and I am not sure how much we known about it, all that to say not sure on what basis we can say the 3060-4060 did not sales well (being the 2 best seller with a large margin), outside the general absolutely nothing do which can be fair.
Content creator feel like they are a bit captured by their audience it seems.
They loved the B580, even if that existed at $250 (they do not), they would not be better value than a $350 9070xt:
9060xt launch, half the gpu for less than half the price of retail 9070xt, significantly better performance per dollar than the 9070xt...
https://tpucdn.com/review/asus-rade...b/images/performance-per-dollar-2560-1440.png
I get not believing the $350 anymore and acting like it will be more $400-$430, but lets be sure that the case, if it launch at $350 it is good enough to force Nvidia to move (i.e. keeping a ~$330-350 price tag for the upcoming 5060s 12GB for example, instead of going 5060ti 8GB street price with it)
They loved the B580, even if that existed at $250 (they do not), they would not be better value than a $350 9070xt:
9060xt launch, half the gpu for less than half the price of retail 9070xt, significantly better performance per dollar than the 9070xt...
https://tpucdn.com/review/asus-rade...b/images/performance-per-dollar-2560-1440.png
I get not believing the $350 anymore and acting like it will be more $400-$430, but lets be sure that the case, if it launch at $350 it is good enough to force Nvidia to move (i.e. keeping a ~$330-350 price tag for the upcoming 5060s 12GB for example, instead of going 5060ti 8GB street price with it)
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Let's do some basic math. According to this chart the 9060 XT offers essentially 5060 Ti performance at $5.00 per frame. Meanwhile the 5060Ti offers nearly identical performance at $6.76 per frame. This means the nvidia card costs 35% more for the same performance. I don't see the issue with the pricing here. The AMD card is significantly cheaper while offering about the same performance in most titles.
I think the main criticism is that Hardware Unboxed does not believe the 8GB model should exist for either the 9060 XT or the 5060 Ti. And I agree in 2025, the 8Gb model is a joke. At the very least 12GB should be the standard for a cheaper model even if this is considered a 'budget' video card.
As for those clamoring for a $349 9070 XT, you're living in koo koo la la lands. Nobody's selling their products for massive losses like that.
Nvidia doesn't even make enough 5000 series to meet demands this generation even though their GPUs are significantly more expensive than AMD.
Why? Because they would far prefer that as many wafers of silicon instead go to their AI business where they can sell AI GPUs to businesses at nearly $10,000 a pop. The normal consumer GPU market is considered chump change for them compared to the professional space so they treat it like the red headed step child and barely allocate any gpu wafers for this 5000 series paper launch.
I think the main criticism is that Hardware Unboxed does not believe the 8GB model should exist for either the 9060 XT or the 5060 Ti. And I agree in 2025, the 8Gb model is a joke. At the very least 12GB should be the standard for a cheaper model even if this is considered a 'budget' video card.
As for those clamoring for a $349 9070 XT, you're living in koo koo la la lands. Nobody's selling their products for massive losses like that.
Nvidia doesn't even make enough 5000 series to meet demands this generation even though their GPUs are significantly more expensive than AMD.
Why? Because they would far prefer that as many wafers of silicon instead go to their AI business where they can sell AI GPUs to businesses at nearly $10,000 a pop. The normal consumer GPU market is considered chump change for them compared to the professional space so they treat it like the red headed step child and barely allocate any gpu wafers for this 5000 series paper launch.
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First, why are they (and you) comparing it at 1440P, when they're the lowest end cards where they will primarily be used to play at 1080P? With the RX 9060 XT 16GB averaging 95.8 FPS vs the RTX 5060 8GB averaging 94 FPS, with a difference of 1.9%. At 1080P, the RX 9060 XT 16GB at $350 will cost $3.65 per frame, and the RTX 5060 8GB at $300 will cost $3.19 per frame. In a 1080P scenario, the RTX 5060 8GB would be the better buy, at $0.46 less per frame.
https://www.techpowerup.com/review/asus-radeon-rx-9060-xt-prime-oc-16-gb/31.html
And second, why is Hardware Unboxed's RTX 5060 8GB at 1440P numbers so drastically different (54 FPS) vs. TechPowerUp's numbers (65.6 FPS)?
Going by TechPowerUp's numbers at 1440P, the RX 9060 XT is at $5.07 per frame, while the RTX 5060 8GB is at $4.57 per frame. In the same scenario at 1440P, TechPowerUp's figures show the RTX 5060 8GB as the better buy, at $0.50 less per frame.
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That completely depends on the selection of game and game section chosen to benchmark, few game appear in both series of benchmark, when they do:
https://tpucdn.com/review/asus-radeon-rx-9060-xt-prime-oc-16-gb/images/starfield-2560-1440.png
https://www.techspot.com/articles-info/2996/bench/Starfield-1440-p.webp
https://tpucdn.com/review/asus-radeon-rx-9060-xt-prime-oc-16-gb/images/cyberpunk-2077-2560-1440.png
https://www.techspot.com/articles-info/2996/bench/CP2077-1440-p.webp
Not necessarily on the same scene so can still be a bit different (but very similar ballpark and ratio between the card), TPU driver are a bit more recent for the 9070xt and 5060ti-5060 according to their test setup, but it is probably more about different section of the game being tested.
The lowest end card tend to be older models (used or from store), apu, laptops, upcoming 9060 gre or 9050, than a new 9060xt 16GB at $350 plus, a 2025 xx60 in 2025 is more a low-mid than lowest end card, when we look at the steam survey all the cards in the top 10 are about the same or slower.
The geomean above 70 @ 1440p despite running the game at ultra setting which for most game you should never do, show that it is a 1440p capable card for a vast portion of someone steam library, it can even play some of the very demanding title like Harry Potter, Last of Us or plague tale requiem at 1440p ultra quality, for high setting it will be most of the games.
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_mockingbird
[H]ard|Gawd
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Imagine if AMD not only made them free, but also paid people to take them.
No way can NVIDIA compete with that!!!
